With a deadly shooting taking place in the heart of St. Paul on Sunday morning, many are concerned with the increase in crime throughout the city as the homicide count now sits at 32.
Ramsey County Sheriff Bob Fletcher and St. Paul Mayor Melvin Carter joined News Talk 830 WCCO's Chad Hartman to discuss the horrible incident and share their thoughts on what they think should be done in the city.
"This is one of the most heartbreaking things that a community can go through," Carter said.
Carter promised that those responsible for the death of Marquisha D. Wiley and those injured will see justice as the SPPD works hard to identify those responsible for taking someone's life.
"I am really proud of the police officers, the medics who showed up right away," Carter said.
According to Fletcher, the night before the shooting, the crowd outside the Seventh Street Truck Park bar was larger than what's usually seen. As a result, he said he felt off about it.
"After years of seeing different crowds, we could tell there was some hostility in the crowd, there was some anti-police hostility, but we could read the hostility between people that were even standing outside," Fletcher said.
Since the ease in COVID-19 restrictions, Fletcher said his men have been going to the bar on Friday nights to ensure that people get home without any issues.
Until last Friday, Fletcher said he had never seen the type of hostility that led to 14 people being injured and one dead, but still, 40 years of service made him think something could happen.
After hearing of what had happened on Sunday morning, Fletcher said that his worries were confirmed.
"My reaction was 'not surprised' based on what we had seen on Friday. I wasn't surprised," Fletcher said. "I was just thankful that there weren't more dead [people]."
According to Fletcher, the reason this happened is because of an understaffed police department.
He said that the St. Paul Police Department is down 120 officers from where it should be and getting adequately staffed will be a considerable asset to stop tragic events like this from happening in the future.
"Extra officers allow proactive, preventive police patrols just like when we are sitting in front of the Truck Park on Friday nights," Fletcher said.
The St. Paul Police Federation shared on Twitter their support for more officers, criticizing the support from the mayor and city council.
"So what should happen is we should hire more officers, we should establish a climate of safety and security, so patrons want to come to St. Paul. So the businesses don't struggle, and we [don't] lose the best restaurant row we have in St. Paul," Fletcher said.
Carter, on the other hand, said he doesn't see more officers as the solution.
"It is not clear to me, and I have never heard the sheriff or anybody else make it clear, how one, 100, or 1,000 police officers would have changed what happened on Saturday night," Carter said.
With many saying more officers are needed to keep the city safe, Carter finds it insulting.
"To say that this happened because of some lack of capacity or because of something our officer didn't or couldn't do is an insult to our officers, not to me, and I am not prepared to accept that going forward," Carter said.
Carter shared that the city has approved upwards of $100 million in overtime for officers and is making every effort to ensure the city is as safe as possible.
Fletcher argued that an increase in overtime won't help because officers are already exhausted. So instead, he continued to voice his support for more officers.
"To those people who say 'well officers don't prevent crimes,' they absolutely do," Fletcher said. "Why do you think there were 70 officers at the Vikings game yesterday? Why do Walmarts hire officers? The presence of police in an area decreases crime; we've seen that my entire career."
Fletcher says the public should have the final say when it comes to more officers being added to St. Paul, but he says the mayor has been very stubborn in adding to the police force.
"What I don't understand is why he doesn't take his chief's advice, don't take the sheriff's advice, it's your chief, Todd Axtel, he's got a lot of experience he knows what he is doing. I don't understand why he wouldn't listen to him," Fletcher said.
When it comes to Axtell's request for more police officers, Carter sees the need, but he acknowledged that policing is not the only thing he has to take care of in the city.
Carter went on to say that he is working to reduce the number of times people call 911 by remodeling the city's public safety models instead of dumping money into hiring new officers.
"Sadly, there are folks who take that as an anti-police position, when in fact I think no one would benefit from that type of approach more than the men and women from the St. Paul Police Department," he said.
However, Fletcher says that all Carter has to do is listen to those around him.
"All he has to do is admit that maybe someone else has a good idea," Fletcher said. He went on to say that he thinks the mayor is a "good person, but he knows absolutely nothing about law enforcement and public safety, and he shouldn't pretend to. He should just take the advice of professionals in the field and then evaluate that advice."
In response to Fletcher's comments on there not being enough police officers in St. Paul, Carter brought up Fletcher's past, saying he needs to adapt.
"Listen, Sheriff Fletcher has been around St. Paul for a really long time," Carter said. "Sadly, he's been around some of the ugliest incidents that have happened regarding law enforcement, and he ends up being the gatekeeper who seems to be pushing back, while the rest of the world is saying we have to evolve our public safety and policing strategies."
Fletcher shared that those who don't feel safe going into the city should "watch your television and wait for your city leaders to stand up front and say 'we're going to make it safe for you.'"
He went on to say that the mayor should put forth extra resources to make the area safe, leaving no doubt in a parent's mind that their 21-year-old child can safely go into the city.
But if officials in the city do not put forth their efforts in keeping the city safe, Fletcher says it's simple, "Don't go."
As for Carter, he has a different opinion, saying that the city is safe and its officers do a good job to keep it that way.
"If they come down there for a hockey game or if they come down there to just grab something to eat for their family, they are likely to bump into me and my family," Carter said.
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